The Great Crop Circle debate
July 24th 2007 03:56
Mysterious crop circles a fascinating subject, you can be sure to be a crop circle story happening somewhere.
Crop circles accounts have been documented since before the crusades and throughout the Middle Ages and well into the 20/21 centuries.
Crop circles why not sand or snow circles "why is it so” (to quote form an old television science show) The majority of crop circle stories seem to be centered in or around fields of starch products like wheat or corn ,why doesn’t manifest itself in a potato paddock?
I am not suggesting that all crop circles are the work of old gizers with little else to do, granted there are hoaxes but to be fair there must be some scientific evidence out there.
Conducting research into crop circles formation is difficult and it would be rather grand if a crop circle just happened to form in a field where you just happened to have your monitoring equipment set up the odds are astronomical ( you have a better chance winning Lotto)
Even the most ardent fans of either the weather or UFO theories admit that a significant fraction of the circles are essentially man-made. It is not hard to make a crop circle all that’s needed is some rope wooden planks and a willing crew.
There seems to be a higher number of crop circles sightings in the northern hemisphere especially in England and the greater U.S.A I am not sure why.
There may be a higher statistical number of reported sightings in these areas or the soil has interacting properties or the sights are located on special grid points that have special electrical resonance, but I am just speculating here.
You have to wonder at the extents some people will go to who have vested interests in selling books and publications to further the popularity of the Crop circles phenomenon.
There is some scientific evidence to support in part the formation of certain forms of Crop circles.
Some crop circles are formed by nature for example heat from wind thermals or lightning strikes, others are formed by electro magnetic forces, the latter being harder to quantify.
There have been many experiments conducted in the U.S and elsewhere. hoping to replicate an actual crop circle with conventional micro wave emitters strong magnetic induction the outcome of these experiments did not yield consistent results.
There where some similarity with forming artificial experimental crop circles in that the stem of the plants had expulsion cavities making the straw of the plant bend at right angles just like the “naturally” formed ones.
There are a number of eyewitnesses, reports who claim to have seen how crop circles appear before their eyes in just a few seconds.
Several of these people say that bright, fluorescent balls of light hovered above the fields at the time the circles were formed.
This video claims to have captured an actual crop circle forming in real time is this the result of clever editing? Hard to prove either way without having access to the original footage if it was edited any image manipulation would become evident take a look at this.
Crop circles forming video link
Australia has incidences of crop circles formation I recall a news article stating that a crop circle had formed in south east Queensland in 2004 I did have a look at the website and there where a number of images shown
The images showed what looked to be a light source imitating for the crop circle.
Visit Australian crop circle website link
When these photos where taken neither lights were visible at the scene they seem to “appear” after the images where exposed. I did make a cursory inspection of the images and I am more likely to conclude that the film may have contained faulty emulsion layer or that an external light source exposed the film during processing as I do not have access to the original negatives I cannot make a definitive conclusion.
Crop circles accounts have been documented since before the crusades and throughout the Middle Ages and well into the 20/21 centuries.
Crop circles why not sand or snow circles "why is it so” (to quote form an old television science show) The majority of crop circle stories seem to be centered in or around fields of starch products like wheat or corn ,why doesn’t manifest itself in a potato paddock?
I am not suggesting that all crop circles are the work of old gizers with little else to do, granted there are hoaxes but to be fair there must be some scientific evidence out there.
Conducting research into crop circles formation is difficult and it would be rather grand if a crop circle just happened to form in a field where you just happened to have your monitoring equipment set up the odds are astronomical ( you have a better chance winning Lotto)
Even the most ardent fans of either the weather or UFO theories admit that a significant fraction of the circles are essentially man-made. It is not hard to make a crop circle all that’s needed is some rope wooden planks and a willing crew.
There seems to be a higher number of crop circles sightings in the northern hemisphere especially in England and the greater U.S.A I am not sure why.
There may be a higher statistical number of reported sightings in these areas or the soil has interacting properties or the sights are located on special grid points that have special electrical resonance, but I am just speculating here.
You have to wonder at the extents some people will go to who have vested interests in selling books and publications to further the popularity of the Crop circles phenomenon.
There is some scientific evidence to support in part the formation of certain forms of Crop circles.
Some crop circles are formed by nature for example heat from wind thermals or lightning strikes, others are formed by electro magnetic forces, the latter being harder to quantify.
There have been many experiments conducted in the U.S and elsewhere. hoping to replicate an actual crop circle with conventional micro wave emitters strong magnetic induction the outcome of these experiments did not yield consistent results.
There where some similarity with forming artificial experimental crop circles in that the stem of the plants had expulsion cavities making the straw of the plant bend at right angles just like the “naturally” formed ones.
There are a number of eyewitnesses, reports who claim to have seen how crop circles appear before their eyes in just a few seconds.
Several of these people say that bright, fluorescent balls of light hovered above the fields at the time the circles were formed.
This video claims to have captured an actual crop circle forming in real time is this the result of clever editing? Hard to prove either way without having access to the original footage if it was edited any image manipulation would become evident take a look at this.
Crop circles forming video link
Australia has incidences of crop circles formation I recall a news article stating that a crop circle had formed in south east Queensland in 2004 I did have a look at the website and there where a number of images shown
The images showed what looked to be a light source imitating for the crop circle.
Visit Australian crop circle website link
When these photos where taken neither lights were visible at the scene they seem to “appear” after the images where exposed. I did make a cursory inspection of the images and I am more likely to conclude that the film may have contained faulty emulsion layer or that an external light source exposed the film during processing as I do not have access to the original negatives I cannot make a definitive conclusion.
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Comment by Mountain Fog
Infognito
1: Radiation levels highest at the centre and decreasing uniformly towards the outer ring(s).
2: The stems indeed having undergone exposure to a number of energy sources, microwave being only one of them.
3: All the stems remain unbroken, in fact are bent without breakage, except for the exploded hole caused by sudden intense heat, a micro burst of energy in that localised are.
4: All stems are woven together, not trampled and smashed as is the case with all man made versions.
5: Evidence proving at least one crop circle (on a large scale) appeared within under 30 minutes, due to sighting by pilot passing, over and back, the same field.
6: Extremely complex geometric design becomes 3 dimensional when expanded on computer software.
7: Independant scientific examination undertaken by leading scientist, who was unaware of where the plant specimens came from, discovered minute ball particles within the plant stems and identified micro wave radiation as being one of the possible sources of energy that could cause the damage to the stems.
8: Suggested reason 80% of world's crop circle appearances are in Southern England is thought due to water table being very close to the surface, and it is seasonal, crop circles occuring when the water table is high, the suggestion being the circles need water for the energy to interact and imprint the designs.
In closing, should anyone continue to doubt what I have put here, or wish to test its veracity, I suggest they look at a documentary made by Academy Award nominee William Gazecki and his film "Crop Circles: Quest For Truth" in which you will see the hard evidence examined and commented upon by a variety of people with differing views as to what is going on with this incredible phenomena.
One link is:
Really Long Link
but you will have to search to find a copy available for purchase. ASK YOUR LOCAL VIDEO STORE TO GET IT IN...IT USED TO BE AVAILABLE, which is how I saw the programme.
However, in closing and in regard to the DVD, one thing no one, with any sense of scientific integrity, who has also seen the evidence first hand, dares to suggest what we are seeing is man made!
For the great thinker and popular scientist, Carl Sagan, (whom I have enormous respect for), to suggest (in an interview) that the two old blokes, (trotted out by the British Government initially, to try and sway the public they were responsible for all these, at times massive phenomena), was disturbing, as Sagan was no fool, but, he had obviously not seen the evidence first hand, or was choosing to lie, possibly to cool down the debate and avoid public panic.
One of these two old 'crop circle maker' blokes, before his death, admitted he had not been responsible for much of what was claimed they did, but when questioned on what was done, he was completely unaware of where these events had occurred when challenged for the detail.
Embarrasingly for the British Government, at the same time the old blokes had their interview for TV, demonstrating their use of their tool, a lump of wood wrapped in cloth attached to a U shaped handle, (they refused to actually make one on camera however), a new crop circle appeared inside a guarded Royal compound.
At no time could these men prove how they made these crop circles, and neither of them had the remotest idea of the complex geometry involved, let alone understand the tools that would be needed to create a large design of such geometric accuracy.
Both of these men were discovered to have had worked for the British military establishment, whether that has any bearing on the matter, I will leave up to you, the readers, to decide.
cheers
fog
Comment by Damo
For the Sake of Argument
My Apologetics
"Occam's razor" - if there are two hypothesis that explain the data equally well choose the simpler.
Ask whether the hypothesis can, at least in principle, be falsified
Both of the above were taken from Carl Sagan suggestions on detecting baloney from science.
Occam's razor is an interesting one because there is sometimes a temptation to choose the most attractive answer rather than the simplest answer. What do you want the answer to be?
The other question that is missing often is the question why?
Often I hear this question asked at the wrong point.
Professor Sundamiller was on to something with his "Why is So?"
You have to ask why to some difficult questions and put you bets behind the simplest answers:
Why mostly advanced western nations?
Why mostly in tall crops that can easily conceil humans?
Why in a particular pattern?
Why not elsewhere? Like a sandy beach.
Why would something leave an obvious circle and try to hide?
Why would anyone fly billions of killometers just to dig in our sandpit? (this one you can take as joke)
Comment by Mountain Fog
Infognito
So far, no government has carried out such research, using independant scientists, and/or reported it to the public.
No, the government's response was this......
I cite the two old geezers, as the government's initial explanation as to the occurrances, and their piece of wood wrapped in an old cloth...give me a break!!!!!
Anyone who believed they had anything at all to do with this phenomenon, I really would wonder about their perspecacity...or their motivations for supporting such an obvious load of nonsense...on this point I re-cite Carl Sagan....supporter of the two old geezers as being the creators of all the crop circles!!!!!!!!!!
Get the DVD and see for yourself....much of the questions you put are covered, and examined with scientific analysis.....
fog
P.S. Of course, it could just be intergalatic graffitti left by errant teen aliens, or maybe they're all bombing range sites!
........OOORRRR.............
it really is an amazing twister, that can draw complex geometric designs loaded with acute angles.....
yeah baby....that must be the answer!!!!!!!! tee hee!
Comment by Mountain Fog
Infognito
and thanks for the oblique reference Carl....
cheers and beers
fog
Comment by Damo
For the Sake of Argument
My Apologetics
Grumpy old bloke with boofy eyebrows.
(Not my favorite scientist)
Yes I remember him well. But despite his arrogance and intimidation, he was right. We always need to ask "Why is it so?"
If the answer is incomplete then you need to know what is missing and the ramifications.
Carl Sagan for the record, was never convinced that ETs had landed on earth and devoted large volumes of works going through each claim step by step.
This was also the case for Fred Hoyle who went step by step through each case and applied the laws of physics to each one.
Not that quoting the name of a scientist matters. It is the evidence that matters and the most rational explaination for that evidence.
Can similar Crop circles be made by people?
If so, why should we accept the more complicated theory of ETs landing and making this mess?